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Global Forums > General > Accidental American seeking advice about filing US taxes and deciding whether to renounce US citizenship
 
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Accidental American seeking advice about filing US taxes and deciding whether to renounce US citizenship

Dear all,


I am a British citizen, living in Switzerland, born in the United States. I left the US aged two, have never had a US social security number, passport, or tax number, have never lived or worked there, and have only visited the US in short stints as a tourist.


But as per the FATCA laws, I am now required, it seems, to decide whether to renounce my US citizenship or not. Both have clear drawbacks - I don't want to be audited by the IRS and pay US taxes if I keep my US citizenship, but it appears that renouncing US citizenship would still require me to pay several thousand Swiss francs. 


Is anyone or has anyone out there found themselves on this particular dilemma's horns: an 'accidental' American with no family ties to the country, with no connections to the country (bar some friends) and who now has to decide to renounce or not? What did you decided to do?


Any and all advice gratefully received!


Kind regards


Elliot


 

The text you are quoting:

Dear all,


I am a British citizen, living in Switzerland, born in the United States. I left the US aged two, have never had a US social security number, passport, or tax number, have never lived or worked there, and have only visited the US in short stints as a tourist.


But as per the FATCA laws, I am now required, it seems, to decide whether to renounce my US citizenship or not. Both have clear drawbacks - I don't want to be audited by the IRS and pay US taxes if I keep my US citizenship, but it appears that renouncing US citizenship would still require me to pay several thousand Swiss francs. 


Is anyone or has anyone out there found themselves on this particular dilemma's horns: an 'accidental' American with no family ties to the country, with no connections to the country (bar some friends) and who now has to decide to renounce or not? What did you decided to do?


Any and all advice gratefully received!


Kind regards


Elliot


 


Elliot WilsonMar 19, 2018 @ 12:58
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Re: Accidental American seeking advice about filing US taxes and deciding whether to renounce US citizenship
Post 1

I am a premeditated US citizen: born elsewhere but naturalized US citizen. But if there is one US governmental entity that does not distinguish amongst different types of citizens, it is the IRS. If you are legally a US citizen, you must file tax returns every year and pay taxes on your income. They will not care if you tell them you did not know. Ignorance of the law does not excuse you from abiding by it, is the rule.


It does not matter:


a) if you have never lived there and have never benefited from their public services, infrastructure or weapons of mass destruction.


b) set foot there in any year in question 


c) where you have earned your income or


d) whether you paid taxes to another country, where you are either a citizen or where you have resided. In France, taxes are residence based, for example.


I am a US citizen, earn my salary in Switzerland, but because I reside in France, I must pay taxes to France and the US as well.


It sounds like the IRS does not know or did not know of your existence because the only document linking you to the US is your birth certificate. I hope your posting in a public forum, with your real name and details of your identity will not attract their attention.


Based on my personal experience and personal knowledge (not professional) I think you have three choices:


1. You either keep a low profile, remove this post and hope they never learn of your existence. But I would not recommend you to do it because it is illegal, and if they catch up with you, you will be in for some heavy penalties in addition to having to make back payments retroactively for all the years when you did not file tax returns, but had an income. They will probably hit you with interest payments too. But then again, they could be understanding and only make you pay your past liabilities, no penalties, no interests.


2. You can renounce your citienship, but then they will immediately look at you IRS records before approving your request and see if you are current with filing your tax returns and tax payments. In addition, there is a payment you must make for rennouncing your citizenship and declare under oath that you are not renouncing it to avoid paying taxes. I have actually witnessed that while waiting at the US embassy for other reasons.


3. You can and probably should, before you do anything else, find out what is your US tax liability. Look at every year when you have had an income, go back to the IRS information pages and find out what you would have owed them each year, after deducting the amount you are allowed to as "foreign earned income" and deducting a certain small amount for what you paid in taxes to another country each year. If your income has been less than $100,000, then  your tax liability for those years will be relatively small. I stress "relativey." If your income has been higher, you are in for a a lot of back payments and penalties. Once you know what your liability is, you can make a better decision. If your tax liability for the last 24 years (since you are 43) is not a lot, you may just want to come clean and move forward either renouncing your US citizenship (as in 2 above) or remaining an outlaw (as in 1 above) until they catch you Laughing.


I hope I am wrong. But if I was you, I would not wait and find out where you stand as soon as possible.


 


 


 

The text you are quoting:

I am a premeditated US citizen: born elsewhere but naturalized US citizen. But if there is one US governmental entity that does not distinguish amongst different types of citizens, it is the IRS. If you are legally a US citizen, you must file tax returns every year and pay taxes on your income. They will not care if you tell them you did not know. Ignorance of the law does not excuse you from abiding by it, is the rule.


It does not matter:


a) if you have never lived there and have never benefited from their public services, infrastructure or weapons of mass destruction.


b) set foot there in any year in question 


c) where you have earned your income or


d) whether you paid taxes to another country, where you are either a citizen or where you have resided. In France, taxes are residence based, for example.


I am a US citizen, earn my salary in Switzerland, but because I reside in France, I must pay taxes to France and the US as well.


It sounds like the IRS does not know or did not know of your existence because the only document linking you to the US is your birth certificate. I hope your posting in a public forum, with your real name and details of your identity will not attract their attention.


Based on my personal experience and personal knowledge (not professional) I think you have three choices:


1. You either keep a low profile, remove this post and hope they never learn of your existence. But I would not recommend you to do it because it is illegal, and if they catch up with you, you will be in for some heavy penalties in addition to having to make back payments retroactively for all the years when you did not file tax returns, but had an income. They will probably hit you with interest payments too. But then again, they could be understanding and only make you pay your past liabilities, no penalties, no interests.


2. You can renounce your citienship, but then they will immediately look at you IRS records before approving your request and see if you are current with filing your tax returns and tax payments. In addition, there is a payment you must make for rennouncing your citizenship and declare under oath that you are not renouncing it to avoid paying taxes. I have actually witnessed that while waiting at the US embassy for other reasons.


3. You can and probably should, before you do anything else, find out what is your US tax liability. Look at every year when you have had an income, go back to the IRS information pages and find out what you would have owed them each year, after deducting the amount you are allowed to as "foreign earned income" and deducting a certain small amount for what you paid in taxes to another country each year. If your income has been less than $100,000, then  your tax liability for those years will be relatively small. I stress "relativey." If your income has been higher, you are in for a a lot of back payments and penalties. Once you know what your liability is, you can make a better decision. If your tax liability for the last 24 years (since you are 43) is not a lot, you may just want to come clean and move forward either renouncing your US citizenship (as in 2 above) or remaining an outlaw (as in 1 above) until they catch you Laughing.


I hope I am wrong. But if I was you, I would not wait and find out where you stand as soon as possible.


 


 


 


JR M, Mar 19, 2018 @ 20:05
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Re: Accidental American seeking advice about filing US taxes and deciding whether to renounce US citizenship
Post 2

Dear Elliot,


The info provided above is basically correct  


You should have a professional look at your Swiss tax returns and determine what, if anything, you owe the IRS. Then you’ll be able to decide for yourself (and family) whether you want peace of mind either by paying what is due and remain a US citizen with annual filing  and reporting obligations, or by paying what is due and then renouncing your citizenship, which is quite easy to do. I am a US attorney practicing in GVA and have had several clients go through this process. Also mind the fact that the IRS has announced a few days ago that the voluntary disclosure program would come to an end in September 2018. So now would be a good time to get started!


Nathalie

The text you are quoting:

Dear Elliot,


The info provided above is basically correct  


You should have a professional look at your Swiss tax returns and determine what, if anything, you owe the IRS. Then you’ll be able to decide for yourself (and family) whether you want peace of mind either by paying what is due and remain a US citizen with annual filing  and reporting obligations, or by paying what is due and then renouncing your citizenship, which is quite easy to do. I am a US attorney practicing in GVA and have had several clients go through this process. Also mind the fact that the IRS has announced a few days ago that the voluntary disclosure program would come to an end in September 2018. So now would be a good time to get started!


Nathalie


Nathalie S, Mar 19, 2018 @ 21:36
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