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Banking Question: Currency Diversification

Are there any banks in Switzerland that have an easy way to diversify my holdings across various foreign currencies?  I know that UBS offers USD and EUR accounts as add-ons to their personal banking service but both choices are looking a bit stinky right now.


I'm looking for something like this, but in Switzerland.

The text you are quoting:

Are there any banks in Switzerland that have an easy way to diversify my holdings across various foreign currencies?  I know that UBS offers USD and EUR accounts as add-ons to their personal banking service but both choices are looking a bit stinky right now.


I'm looking for something like this, but in Switzerland.


richardmJan 18, 2011 @ 13:46
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 1

try Raifeissen ... i know they offer multi currency mortgages so maybe multi currency cash deposit accounts as well .. dont know


But maybe worth looking into investing in a global currency Fund... offered by most major investment houses.


They will have daily liquidity, maybe a minimum less than 10k, and are actively managed to take advantage of the interest rate differentials.


I cant give you advice here as to which to buy..sorry (its illegal).. but ask your banker.

The text you are quoting:

try Raifeissen ... i know they offer multi currency mortgages so maybe multi currency cash deposit accounts as well .. dont know


But maybe worth looking into investing in a global currency Fund... offered by most major investment houses.


They will have daily liquidity, maybe a minimum less than 10k, and are actively managed to take advantage of the interest rate differentials.


I cant give you advice here as to which to buy..sorry (its illegal).. but ask your banker.


Charlie, Jan 18, 2011 @ 14:00
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 2

I have a CS account and they'll let me have pretty much any currency in a seperate account. I also have a Julius Bar account who will do the same but with a 1500CHF annual fee. Lastly I have an HSBC Premier acc which in all their advertising says they'll let you hold multiple currencies but I haven't tested them on this. (yes, I am somewhat overbanked, 3 countries & currencies in 3 years will do that for you...)


As Charlie mentioned you can get a currency fund from many places but then you give up your autonomy to move around as you want.


As for which you might want, I'd trade range breakout extension strategies. Most currencies traders are technical analysts at heart...

The text you are quoting:

I have a CS account and they'll let me have pretty much any currency in a seperate account. I also have a Julius Bar account who will do the same but with a 1500CHF annual fee. Lastly I have an HSBC Premier acc which in all their advertising says they'll let you hold multiple currencies but I haven't tested them on this. (yes, I am somewhat overbanked, 3 countries & currencies in 3 years will do that for you...)


As Charlie mentioned you can get a currency fund from many places but then you give up your autonomy to move around as you want.


As for which you might want, I'd trade range breakout extension strategies. Most currencies traders are technical analysts at heart...


Feehary, Jan 18, 2011 @ 14:33
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 3

I have a CS account and they'll let me have pretty much any currency in a seperate account. I also have a Julius Bar account who will do the same but with a 1500CHF annual fee. Lastly I have an HSBC Premier acc which in all their advertising says they'll let you hold multiple currencies but I haven't tested them on this. (yes, I am somewhat overbanked, 3 countries & currencies in 3 years will do that for you...)

As Charlie mentioned you can get a currency fund from many places but then you give up your autonomy to move around as you want.

As for which you might want, I'd trade range breakout extension strategies. Most currencies traders are technical analysts at heart...


Jan 18, 11 14:33

There are a few free currency trading systems online (test systems), from the likes of Deutsche, ACM, GNI etc etc... Once you decide to go "live" then accounts are 50k.. and you trade on leveraged margin... so if youre the wrong side of a trade, that is left open overnight... you wake up to nothing, or a nice early call on capital, unless you're comfortable with trailing stops, or fixed stop loss positions... However,  If you have never traded before I would not advise this route.


A fund is more likely to get you a return than multi currency cash deposits, since youre always at risk anyway to the reference currency level, or you could think about  multi currency Govt paper.. play the high IR countries with a view on a eventual fall in the CHF value, and subsequent xchange rate benefits.


If you just want cash diversifaction... mmm .... im not sure banging it all out into Renimbi and Yuan and Yen and the such like is your best bet.


Maybe think about a liquid low vol equity product for the year...


again... your banker should help

The text you are quoting:

There are a few free currency trading systems online (test systems), from the likes of Deutsche, ACM, GNI etc etc... Once you decide to go "live" then accounts are 50k.. and you trade on leveraged margin... so if youre the wrong side of a trade, that is left open overnight... you wake up to nothing, or a nice early call on capital, unless you're comfortable with trailing stops, or fixed stop loss positions... However,  If you have never traded before I would not advise this route.


A fund is more likely to get you a return than multi currency cash deposits, since youre always at risk anyway to the reference currency level, or you could think about  multi currency Govt paper.. play the high IR countries with a view on a eventual fall in the CHF value, and subsequent xchange rate benefits.


If you just want cash diversifaction... mmm .... im not sure banging it all out into Renimbi and Yuan and Yen and the such like is your best bet.


Maybe think about a liquid low vol equity product for the year...


again... your banker should help


Charlie, Jan 18, 2011 @ 15:23
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 4

Thanks Charlie.  It's just a diversification issue.  I'm not interested in becoming a currency trader.


Both earning and spending in CHF serves as a hedge against currency fluctuations (which is great for now) but at some point in the future I'm going to take my pile and leave Switzerland.  I do NOT plan to return to the US, so trying to market-time the USD/CHF pair isn't very useful, nor do I think it wise to remain USD heavy (as I am now).  As a global citizen, I feel that it's prudent to hold a basket of well-managed currencies.  Everbank would be perfect but dealing with a US bank ("IBAN?  What's that?") from here seems cumbersome.

The text you are quoting:

Thanks Charlie.  It's just a diversification issue.  I'm not interested in becoming a currency trader.


Both earning and spending in CHF serves as a hedge against currency fluctuations (which is great for now) but at some point in the future I'm going to take my pile and leave Switzerland.  I do NOT plan to return to the US, so trying to market-time the USD/CHF pair isn't very useful, nor do I think it wise to remain USD heavy (as I am now).  As a global citizen, I feel that it's prudent to hold a basket of well-managed currencies.  Everbank would be perfect but dealing with a US bank ("IBAN?  What's that?") from here seems cumbersome.


richardm, Jan 18, 2011 @ 15:54
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 5

IBAN is your personal current account number..(IBAN stands for International Bank Account Number) ... and its shown on your maestro card... and when u transfer money via IB (internet banking) you can input the IBAN of the person youre sending cash to  (or same if someone is sending you cash they input yours ) and the money goes where it is supposed to go.

The text you are quoting:

IBAN is your personal current account number..(IBAN stands for International Bank Account Number) ... and its shown on your maestro card... and when u transfer money via IB (internet banking) you can input the IBAN of the person youre sending cash to  (or same if someone is sending you cash they input yours ) and the money goes where it is supposed to go.


Charlie, Jan 18, 2011 @ 16:14
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 6

IBAN is your personal current account number..(IBAN stands for International Bank Account Number) ... and its shown on your maestro card... and when u transfer money via IB (internet banking) you can input the IBAN of the person youre sending cash to  (or same if someone is sending you cash they input yours ) and the money goes where it is supposed to go.


Jan 18, 11 16:14

Ya, I know that.  The US banks don't.  It's too cumbersome to transfer money to/from the US.

The text you are quoting:

Ya, I know that.  The US banks don't.  It's too cumbersome to transfer money to/from the US.


richardm, Jan 18, 2011 @ 16:26
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 7

Ya, I know that.  The US banks don't.  It's too cumbersome to transfer money to/from the US.


Jan 18, 11 16:26

he he... you'd be suprised how many people dont know what IBAN is....


As i said... a currency fund..low vol, highly liquid, may suit..although it will be most likely denominated in USD or CHF if you buy from here, so the reference currency is important.


Personally, with 10k or whatever , I'd be looking to a good steady global equity fund... sod the currency exchange, you'll make more on the recovering markets this year than having cash sit in yuan, and sing dollars etc...  plus most of the ones you can buy from here are liquid enough to get your cash out by week end if need be.

The text you are quoting:

he he... you'd be suprised how many people dont know what IBAN is....


As i said... a currency fund..low vol, highly liquid, may suit..although it will be most likely denominated in USD or CHF if you buy from here, so the reference currency is important.


Personally, with 10k or whatever , I'd be looking to a good steady global equity fund... sod the currency exchange, you'll make more on the recovering markets this year than having cash sit in yuan, and sing dollars etc...  plus most of the ones you can buy from here are liquid enough to get your cash out by week end if need be.


Charlie, Jan 18, 2011 @ 16:28
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 8

"Are there any banks in Switzerland that have an easy way to diversify my holdings across various foreign currencies?  I know that UBS offers USD and EUR accounts as add-ons to their personal banking service but both choices are looking a bit stinky right now."--


The local cuntry will keep all the "diversified" foreign valute deposites connected to their own: the US account in Switzerland will always stay "CHF transferred to US" at any moment. Meaning they will somehow charge you to compensate the "unhealthy" USD advantage, because they donot really "recognise" the USD.


Your keeping money in different countries is the only way to diversify currencywise (and not also "investmentwise").

The text you are quoting:

"Are there any banks in Switzerland that have an easy way to diversify my holdings across various foreign currencies?  I know that UBS offers USD and EUR accounts as add-ons to their personal banking service but both choices are looking a bit stinky right now."--


The local cuntry will keep all the "diversified" foreign valute deposites connected to their own: the US account in Switzerland will always stay "CHF transferred to US" at any moment. Meaning they will somehow charge you to compensate the "unhealthy" USD advantage, because they donot really "recognise" the USD.


Your keeping money in different countries is the only way to diversify currencywise (and not also "investmentwise").


HelenaTravel, Jan 18, 2011 @ 17:08
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 9

I'm not sure that last post is correct; it certainly isn't in my case.


With regard to the suggestion to buy funds, this would be a very easy and inexpensive way of diversifying your currency exposure (albeit with some market risk).


The cheapest way by far would be to open a Schwab/ Ameritrade (other providers are available) account in the US as their transaction and custody costs are very low.


I would stick to ETFs (exchange traded funds; explanation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchange-traded_fund).


They are basically index products with no active manager risk. As such the costs are very low (spread/ management fee). They also provide instant liquidity. You can choose the area and will benefit from the exchange rate moves through the pricing of the fund.


Last thing, there are several high yielding ETFs knocking around which would be lower risk.

The text you are quoting:

I'm not sure that last post is correct; it certainly isn't in my case.


With regard to the suggestion to buy funds, this would be a very easy and inexpensive way of diversifying your currency exposure (albeit with some market risk).


The cheapest way by far would be to open a Schwab/ Ameritrade (other providers are available) account in the US as their transaction and custody costs are very low.


I would stick to ETFs (exchange traded funds; explanation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchange-traded_fund).


They are basically index products with no active manager risk. As such the costs are very low (spread/ management fee). They also provide instant liquidity. You can choose the area and will benefit from the exchange rate moves through the pricing of the fund.


Last thing, there are several high yielding ETFs knocking around which would be lower risk.


Feehary, Jan 18, 2011 @ 17:24
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 10

I'm not sure that last post is correct; it certainly isn't in my case.

With regard to the suggestion to buy funds, this would be a very easy and inexpensive way of diversifying your currency exposure (albeit with some market risk).

The cheapest way by far would be to open a Schwab/ Ameritrade (other providers are available) account in the US as their transaction and custody costs are very low.

I would stick to ETFs (exchange traded funds; explanation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchange-traded_fund).

They are basically index products with no active manager risk. As such the costs are very low (spread/ management fee). They also provide instant liquidity. You can choose the area and will benefit from the exchange rate moves through the pricing of the fund.

Last thing, there are several high yielding ETFs knocking around which would be lower risk.


Jan 18, 11 17:24

Agree... Sorry Helena, but your post was inaccurate...or should I say utter crap.

The text you are quoting:

Agree... Sorry Helena, but your post was inaccurate...or should I say utter crap.


Charlie, Jan 18, 2011 @ 17:37
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 11

I tend to agree with Charlie about Helena's post.  Look, Richardm, what are you trying to achieve?  You want to hold some savings in something other than CHF.  You need to understand that is the CHF goes up, some other currency goes down relative to the CHF.  So use your CHF to buy whatever currency will be flavour of the month in 12 month's time.  What will it be?  Dunno.  But the CHF cannot stay high forever because it hurts the basic Swiss economy/.exports.  So your choices are the EUR, USD, GBP and maybe AUD, and SGD.  Would you trust the ruble, AED or Chinese currrencies? I don't, but could be wrong.  Buy shares in those countries instead.  And don't forget go,ld and silver.


 

The text you are quoting:

I tend to agree with Charlie about Helena's post.  Look, Richardm, what are you trying to achieve?  You want to hold some savings in something other than CHF.  You need to understand that is the CHF goes up, some other currency goes down relative to the CHF.  So use your CHF to buy whatever currency will be flavour of the month in 12 month's time.  What will it be?  Dunno.  But the CHF cannot stay high forever because it hurts the basic Swiss economy/.exports.  So your choices are the EUR, USD, GBP and maybe AUD, and SGD.  Would you trust the ruble, AED or Chinese currrencies? I don't, but could be wrong.  Buy shares in those countries instead.  And don't forget go,ld and silver.


 


tax_exile, Jan 24, 2011 @ 19:55
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 12

You should try buying some BitCoins. It's a currency on the rise! ;)

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You should try buying some BitCoins. It's a currency on the rise! ;)


cantarell, Jan 25, 2011 @ 23:36
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 13

Hi Richard, You're considered a US person for these purposes, right ? Have you found that this narrowed your choices at all when comes opening an investment (rather than deposit) account?


Gains on Investment directly in collectives, even notional curncy gains, can lead to a punitive PFIC tax exposure. Investment via a non US DVA can get round both this and FBAR reporting, Some come with an open choice of custodians as well as SEC registered discretionary advisers, who will reconcile current currency outlooks, against your longer term asset-liability objectives.


Sure it costs, but when currencies can fluctuate by 5 or even  10%, against each in a month ..

The text you are quoting:

Hi Richard, You're considered a US person for these purposes, right ? Have you found that this narrowed your choices at all when comes opening an investment (rather than deposit) account?


Gains on Investment directly in collectives, even notional curncy gains, can lead to a punitive PFIC tax exposure. Investment via a non US DVA can get round both this and FBAR reporting, Some come with an open choice of custodians as well as SEC registered discretionary advisers, who will reconcile current currency outlooks, against your longer term asset-liability objectives.


Sure it costs, but when currencies can fluctuate by 5 or even  10%, against each in a month ..


wilycoyote, Jan 26, 2011 @ 09:07
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 14

Agree... Sorry Helena, but your post was inaccurate...or should I say utter crap.


Jan 18, 11 17:37

There are foreign currency accounts, right, but when you take them from the bank, withdraw, or transfer, they might charge for the exchange extra. Just that.


Thanks for consistently inspiring me in so many fields of life!

The text you are quoting:

There are foreign currency accounts, right, but when you take them from the bank, withdraw, or transfer, they might charge for the exchange extra. Just that.


Thanks for consistently inspiring me in so many fields of life!


HelenaTravel, Jan 27, 2011 @ 23:58
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 15

There are foreign currency accounts, right, but when you take them from the bank, withdraw, or transfer, they might charge for the exchange extra. Just that.

Thanks for consistently inspiring me in so many fields of life!


Jan 27, 11 23:58

Love is in the air...

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Love is in the air...


catalin, Jan 28, 2011 @ 09:26
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Re: Banking Question: Currency Diversification
Post 16

To all, thanks for your help and advice.


I'm going to wait for my 2010 tax return packages to be drafted before I make any moves.  I have questions surrounding the tax status of IRA and Roth IRA contributions.  When I have some firm numbers in my hand, I'll put a plan together that may include using my existing relationship with an IRA custodian.

The text you are quoting:

To all, thanks for your help and advice.


I'm going to wait for my 2010 tax return packages to be drafted before I make any moves.  I have questions surrounding the tax status of IRA and Roth IRA contributions.  When I have some firm numbers in my hand, I'll put a plan together that may include using my existing relationship with an IRA custodian.


richardm, Jan 28, 2011 @ 10:46
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