wake up iannis, it sounds as if you're surprised this is happening. if you're surprised then you're either naive or very very young. 

it's happening all over the world, every day. it's not nice, it's not legal in some places, but it's human nature. the landlord or flat-mate want people that they considers good and low risk, so they do a selection process.

i have no idea about your specific case, i am talking in general terms.

wake up to the real world.  

Thank you mark for you kind and polite words.
So, do not bring up to a discussion the bad parts of our human nature, just accept them and make the world an even worst place to live!
Enjoy you real world mark, as some of us try to change it.

you posted because you wanted feedback, you got it.

if you posted only to hear people say how right you are and how evil those landlords are, you should have said so.

anyway, keep changing the world by posting surprised reflections on the human nature, you're on the right track. i have no doubt the flat mate who rejected you is now suffering regrets

You made you mark, mark. In a irony competition you are an absolute winner!

it is often said that life is a mirror. so, 

"  I don't want you because you are Greek, or because you are too old......" 

maybe you project that in your approach. however, maybe you should think more proactively and think about what it is they want to see in a flatmate or tennant. and then project that image.

in the words of shakespeare, "all the worlds a stage, and all the men and women merely players"

instead of focusing your replies each time on how good or bad i am, try focusing your replies on reality and on the topic you chose to discuss. it will move the discussion forward, which i think is what you really want 

Yes, epicure, I think I know what you mean. It may help, thanks.

Iannis,I can understand that you would be very annoyed at this behaviour.People are not able to say" I don't want you because you are female/ have a foreign- sounding name/ are gay/ have some kind of disability/are over 40" etc etc. because they know they are discriminating and that it is unjust .

it IS disgusting but.....as others have said.....this is how the world is.All we can do is continue to challenge those prejudices.

"All we can do is continue to challenge those prejudices."
There you have a point, buzzcocks!
Challenging prejudices makes me "naive"? Do I have to "wake up"?
Some people who come from a rich and prosperous country think that they have the right to give orders, blame me for "naivity", etc. Even the use of imprerative voice shows their character, if any.

Yes, feels bad... I would be pi...d off as well

mark spencer, I am really offended from your answers!
Calling me "naive", ironically saying that I may be "very very young" and using the imperative voice twice, to order me to "wake up", makes me really angry.

With all due respect Iannis, if someone is choosing a "flatmate" ..ie someone they have to live with on a day to day basis, and theyre willing to share thier flat with.. then they have a right to choose, and not to accept the first person that rings them up.

Maybe a girl doesnt want to share with a guy... maybe a guy wants someone his age or on his wave length... 

It can be as simple as youre too old, or male...  but the thing is, they have the right to choose.

Maybe they should have been honest and said, sorry, no guys, or sorry I want someone younger... maybe that would have been more honest.. but woudl it have made you feel any better?

I doubt it.

Iannis,

For flat renting: I understand why you are angry... we're already living in a city where finding a flat is a tough task, and it's as if you don't get the same chances as others. You should know if you suspect you are discriminated by landlords or agencies because of your origine or age, you can try to talk with ASLOCA, they're an association provinding legal advice on people facing problems on the renting market.

For flat sharing: I don't know if I can totally blame the people, when it comes to sharing a flat with them. First of all you don't know their reasons, you don't know if it has anything to do with your age or origin. To be honest, I subrenbted one of my bedrooms a couple of years ago and when I had to chose my flatmate-to-be, I deliberately discarded any male candidate... simply because I didn't feel confortable having a male flatmate to share a bathroom with, hang my underewear on the line in front of him, etc (I'm not saying the male flatmate would have been disrespectful or would even be interested in me, but I just didnt feel confortable with the idea). It was also important for me that my flatmate-to-be would be a non-smoker and as I am a Muslim, somebody who is confortable with being around some aspects of my faith.

Sharing a flat is somehow sharing part of your life: when it comes to it, you prefer to live with people with whom you can get along well. I think compatibility in lifestyles is crucial. The flatmate I used to have is still up to today one of my best friends. We're from completely different origins (I'm Arab she's South American) but we had enough in common to make it work.

Now it is true that the problem in Switzerland, most of people looking for flatmates are young students who look for other students.Very few people over 30 in Swiss population would share a flat, unlike in other places where flatsharing is common even for married couples or people with children. But things are changing and people from all ages and backgrounds lok to flatshare nowasays. Depending on where you work, you might also try to see if your company can help you if they have privileged contacts with agencies. Sometimes you don't know until you ask.

Iannis:

May we suggest you ask yourself if you raised right questions BEFORE visiting and not to be shuffled aside once viewing the flat or room thus losing time and nerves.Your financial status, your occupation, your personality....So many important criteria for the landlord, tenant or owner as well as for yourself. If you are an independant/free-lance you can evaluate a possibility to offer paying (reasonably) several months rent in advance, and provide usual security deposit before you are asked. But do not forget to read the lease and beware of sublets.

Like anything, it's a numbers game - just expect that with every 10 enquiries you make they'll be 2 or 3 no replies, 2 or 3 positive replies, and a mix of bullshit with the rest.

I for one spotted that your forum wasn't actually titled "Have a go at me if you're own life sucks" - you seem like a decent bloke mate, with a valid observation, so I wouldn't bother getting angry at anonymous comments - You usually find that those poeple are over 40 living with their mum, under 10 using their Dad's iPad, or simply just drive a Volvo and wear v-neck sweaters with shorts.

Happy house-hunting.

Hi Charlie!

Yes, everybody has the right to chose a flatmate, including me. I wouldn't like to share a flat with guys half my age, for sure.
The point to my post is that I find ridiculous the way some people lie instead of saying the truth:
E.g. "Sorry, but I have many applicants whose profile suits better to the flatmate I am looking for".

The thread is about lying and hypocrisy, not about finding an apartment.
After 3,5 year in Switzerland I am aware of the shortage.

Thanks anyway, nice answer.
Take care,
Iannis

oh you delicate fellow man. yes, i think being surprised that sometimes people pass you over for apartments because they prefer someone else, means you're either naive or young. i am not saying that to hurt you, i am saying that because the situation you describe is something that every reasonable person, unless naive or young, understands to be a part of real life.

if your real noble objective is to "challenge prejudices" then there are far more serious ones than a white male from western europe being passed over on an apt for rent in switzerland

ok, i get that, makes sense.

wasn't clear (at least to me) that your original point was about the lying.

One more funny thing:
I was invited to see an apartment. I brought with me all my documents.
I understand that the tenant who's name is on the contract wants to be sure that I will pay the rent. Fare and square!
Before singing an aggreement, I have asked to see his contract with the landlord, his ID and of course a proof of his financial status. I believe I have all the right to ask so because:

1) If the contract has rules that I do not like I have to know in advance as I will be sharing the flat.

2) As I will be using one of the two similar size / type bedrooms and share all the other rooms (kitchen, living room, etc) I want a proof that I am paying 50% of the rent and costs and not more. If his term is to ask more that 50% I have the right to know, accept or reject.

3) I have to right to know his finacial status too! As I am asked to pay my share to him and he is is adding his share and pays the total to the landlord, what will happen if he fails to? I guess they will throw us out both, although I have paid my share to the flatmate!

To this point I have to alert everybody that in several cases I have realised that some rent a 3 or 4 bedroom apartment and they sublet it in parts actually making money out of it. This is illegal!
Never pay cash! Ask their bank account, transfer the rent and keep the receipt. Better safe than sorry!

Nor to me.

I think "deceitfulness" would have been a better description.

But, as others have said, people are entitled to choose their flat-mate and they are not obliged to give a reason for their choice.

The fact that you reeceive a reply at all, even if it is not truthful, is already a bonus.  Some advertisers don't even bother to acknowledge a message.

All the best nevertheless, R.

Unfortunately discrimiation goes both ways.  The landlord / flatmate wants to find someone who is able to pay the rent, who is responsible, clean, and someone he / she "clicks" with.  You might have all the documents to prove that you can pay the rent and even buy the whole place if it was for sale, but if you simply don't have a matching personality, or the landlord / flatmate doesn't get a good vibe from you for some reason, then you are out of luck.  Now is this something that you can control?... nope, it's just a matter of luck.  However, as a tenant or prospective flatmate, you would be looking at the same things, and would discriminate upwards if the flatmate on site is not of your liking.

If you have to decide on sharing space with someone I think the points you posted above make perfect sense, and if I was the flatmate I would actually like that, because it shows that you are willing to comply with your part of the deal.  This ensures alignement with the rules and responsibilities that comes from sharing a space that does not belong to either of you.

But yes, searching for an apartment is just as frustrating as searching for a job these days.  Too much demand, and not enough supply, and nobody likes to feel rejected.

Good luck!

re 2)

If you are renting furnished accommodation, you must also expect to pay something for the use – and wear and tear costs -- of furniture, bed linens, kitchen equipment and utensils, bathroom fitments. cleaning materials and general household expenses.

Many people are remarkably carefree in their handling of other people’s possessions – as any hotel or boarding-house keeper will confirm.

R.

Would agree with you 100% Iannis. People who do this are out and out wankers. If there is some reason why they find you unacceptable then just say it. I'm guessing you're not a piece of china. For people who think it makes them look worldly wise to say, "Grow up!" and "This is just how the world is.." Yes! We f..king know! However, maybe it would help if they actually said, "No, we don't want you for x, y or z reason instead of trotting out these PC bullshit lines. As for coming out with, "We have a number of candidates who better suit our needs...", welcome to generation P & G!