Hey Glocals, I need some help,
Almost a year ago, I moved into a great apartment with a huge, private terrace. The building configuration is a little weird, but essentially I am on the first floor with a terrace that sits on top of some shops, and my downstairs nighbor has a garden that is behind the shops.
I have never met these neighbors, which I know is very normal here, though I hear their kids playing in the yard and sometimes inside. They are actually often really loud, frequently to the point of screaming, but that is not the part that bothers me.
I came home from work the other day, however, to find that these neighbors had crawled up to tie a canopy onto my terrace railing to cast shade over their garden. I was a little weirded out that someone would have come up to my terrace without bothering to ask, so I untied it thinking that this would be enough to have them come up to say, "Oh, is it okay that we do this?". I don't have a huge issue with the canopy tied to the railing, but I do have an issue that strangers came up onto my terrace without asking.
Long story short, I have now untied the canopy and they have retied it several times, including coming up while I was actually sitting here just inside the door and not bothering to even acknowledge that I was there.
Is this normal Swiss behavior? Am I out of line for being offended? I have become very accustomed to respecting other people's space and privacy, so this now feels like an invasion.
If they do it again, I will likely leave it, as I don't want a neighbor-war. I am very uncomfortable with it, however, and would just like to know if this is something that is normal and that I shouldn't be offended by.
Thank you for your kind help and experiences!
Hey Glocals, I need some help,
Almost a year ago, I moved into a great apartment with a huge, private terrace. The building configuration is a little weird, but essentially I am on the first floor with a terrace that sits on top of some shops, and my downstairs nighbor has a garden that is behind the shops.
I have never met these neighbors, which I know is very normal here, though I hear their kids playing in the yard and sometimes inside. They are actually often really loud, frequently to the point of screaming, but that is not the part that bothers me.
I came home from work the other day, however, to find that these neighbors had crawled up to tie a canopy onto my terrace railing to cast shade over their garden. I was a little weirded out that someone would have come up to my terrace without bothering to ask, so I untied it thinking that this would be enough to have them come up to say, "Oh, is it okay that we do this?". I don't have a huge issue with the canopy tied to the railing, but I do have an issue that strangers came up onto my terrace without asking.
Long story short, I have now untied the canopy and they have retied it several times, including coming up while I was actually sitting here just inside the door and not bothering to even acknowledge that I was there.
Is this normal Swiss behavior? Am I out of line for being offended? I have become very accustomed to respecting other people's space and privacy, so this now feels like an invasion.
If they do it again, I will likely leave it, as I don't want a neighbor-war. I am very uncomfortable with it, however, and would just like to know if this is something that is normal and that I shouldn't be offended by.
Thank you for your kind help and experiences!
mollymeriMay 7, 2013 @ 17:36
Having lived in rental housing for the last 20 years, I recommend doing everything that you possibly can to avoid a war with your neighbours. Given enough motivation and time, they can make life very uncomfortable for you even if you're doing nothing wrong.
I know that this particular issue is rather petty but it's precisely the kind of thing that can injure someone's fragile ego. Add the culture and the language gap to the mix and the potential for the regie to be partial and sympathetic to their complaints (legit or otherwise) and things can become messy very quickly.
A commercial apartment complex in the US with a 5% vacancy rate and the rents set at market level will have a managerial staff with a vested interest in maintaining good order and harmony on their property. A Swiss regie with zero vacancy, a waiting list of tenants, and fixation du loyer keeping rents down has little incentive to act in good faith and to deal with conflicts in a fair manner. I recommend that you do not awaken that sleeping giant.
Having lived in rental housing for the last 20 years, I recommend doing everything that you possibly can to avoid a war with your neighbours. Given enough motivation and time, they can make life very uncomfortable for you even if you're doing nothing wrong.
I know that this particular issue is rather petty but it's precisely the kind of thing that can injure someone's fragile ego. Add the culture and the language gap to the mix and the potential for the regie to be partial and sympathetic to their complaints (legit or otherwise) and things can become messy very quickly.
A commercial apartment complex in the US with a 5% vacancy rate and the rents set at market level will have a managerial staff with a vested interest in maintaining good order and harmony on their property. A Swiss regie with zero vacancy, a waiting list of tenants, and fixation du loyer keeping rents down has little incentive to act in good faith and to deal with conflicts in a fair manner. I recommend that you do not awaken that sleeping giant.
richardm, May 7, 2013 @ 18:21
Good advice, thank you.
I also experienced strange behaviours in my building, even tho, the majority of the names on the mail box is clearly non swiss. The other day, a man was smoking walking down the stairs, this is something that happens everyday, and since there are no windows, the smoke sits there for hours. Anyway, when I asked him if he could - please- smoke once outside, he told me he has been living in the building for 15 years, and as a newly-arrived I had no rights to give orders.
Not to mention, people leaving their bikes inside the hall or other spitting on the mirror in the elevator.
I think, where in a building every single apartment is not owned but rented, people tend not to care of what happens outside their doors, involving keeping good relationships with neighbours. Not only in here.
I also experienced strange behaviours in my building, even tho, the majority of the names on the mail box is clearly non swiss. The other day, a man was smoking walking down the stairs, this is something that happens everyday, and since there are no windows, the smoke sits there for hours. Anyway, when I asked him if he could - please- smoke once outside, he told me he has been living in the building for 15 years, and as a newly-arrived I had no rights to give orders.
Not to mention, people leaving their bikes inside the hall or other spitting on the mirror in the elevator.
I think, where in a building every single apartment is not owned but rented, people tend not to care of what happens outside their doors, involving keeping good relationships with neighbours. Not only in here.
roberta m, May 7, 2013 @ 19:18
Did you speak with the concierge about it? They have some level of authority, know all the tenants and should be capable to solve this kind of conflict. I had an issue witha neighbor one time and the concierge took care of it without it ever getting to the regie.
Did you speak with the concierge about it? They have some level of authority, know all the tenants and should be capable to solve this kind of conflict. I had an issue witha neighbor one time and the concierge took care of it without it ever getting to the regie.
catalin, May 7, 2013 @ 20:04
The terrace is only one flight up, therefore climbable for the determined, and it was just tied directly to the rails of the terrace.
In the end, that is what I did. The next time they were out there, having retied it again, I just went out and introduced myself, saying that I didn't mind so much, but that I thought it might be nice to know each other, first.
The terrace is only one flight up, therefore climbable for the determined, and it was just tied directly to the rails of the terrace.
In the end, that is what I did. The next time they were out there, having retied it again, I just went out and introduced myself, saying that I didn't mind so much, but that I thought it might be nice to know each other, first.
mollymeri, May 8, 2013 @ 10:17
I agree with Lisa V: I think that your passive-aggressive reaction has probably perpetuated the issue.
I would be very annoyed with a neighbour who appeared to feel free to come into my rented space, but I would prefer to confront them about it straight away. I don't mean that I would provoke an argument, but I would tell them, at least, that I was puzzled by the situation. They may then come across as entitled and hostile, but it's more likely that they will be slightly apologetic and explain themselves further. You then have the opportunity to very nice and understanding about it.
My guess would be that they did not know how to approach you about it due to language or cultural issues and it will be a relief to them to clear the air with you.
On a practical level, it's in your interests to be on good terms with anyone who has such easy access to your terrace.
Good luck!
Andy
I agree with Lisa V: I think that your passive-aggressive reaction has probably perpetuated the issue.
I would be very annoyed with a neighbour who appeared to feel free to come into my rented space, but I would prefer to confront them about it straight away. I don't mean that I would provoke an argument, but I would tell them, at least, that I was puzzled by the situation. They may then come across as entitled and hostile, but it's more likely that they will be slightly apologetic and explain themselves further. You then have the opportunity to very nice and understanding about it.
My guess would be that they did not know how to approach you about it due to language or cultural issues and it will be a relief to them to clear the air with you.
On a practical level, it's in your interests to be on good terms with anyone who has such easy access to your terrace.
Good luck!
Andy
Andy C, May 8, 2013 @ 10:20
I might be a bit late for the party, but here my 10 cents.
Who owns the building? If it is privatly owned, does the owner collect the rents or is there a real estate company involved.
Usually, there are lots of regulations what tenant can do with the outside of the building. A large canopy with enough wind could damage railings, so I highly doubt, that doing something like that is in accordance with the terms and conditions.
I clearly think, that it is not normal behaviour and I would be angry, if they had done it to me.
I might be a bit late for the party, but here my 10 cents.
Who owns the building? If it is privatly owned, does the owner collect the rents or is there a real estate company involved.
Usually, there are lots of regulations what tenant can do with the outside of the building. A large canopy with enough wind could damage railings, so I highly doubt, that doing something like that is in accordance with the terms and conditions.
I clearly think, that it is not normal behaviour and I would be angry, if they had done it to me.
Alan S, May 11, 2013 @ 20:36
