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For the frontalier...

Hey all,


Just want to post a few links and some tips, for the new or even existing frontalier. It seems spring is in the air, and as like myself this time last year, people are now on the move into and out of Geneve area.


I live just across the border in a small French village, it took a while but we now have a good friend basis of bothe French and expats alike, and are close to supermarkets etc. Shopping in France is cheaper as is rent and utilities, you may not be next to a hundred restaurants, nightclubs and need to drive most places but this is the price you pay for cheaper rent and a quieter pace of life.


If you are considering a frontalier move, there is an association dedicated to the cause. http://www.frontalier.org/index.htm


I do not work in Geneve but my wife does, and she has dual country insurance with MMA in Ferney Voltaire at around 116eur a month.


We use Orange.fr internet and phone, a package is around 36eur a month.Picked this up at the local Orange shop, took about 2 months to get it finally installed due to complications but since then no problems at all, always have 100mbs connection, and a phone line with free calls to most EU landlines. They have an english support line also.


We have 2 cars on the road with insurance costing around 100eur a month for both .A big 4x4 and a small cinqecento, no claims did not carry over for me but its still cheaper than the same insurance in Ireland for example. I use AXA France, they do not have an English speaking line, but I got nearly everything done online, and then my very few words of French and a patient customer service agent got the rest done. Big bonus about the French car, no road tax in France, so all you need to pay is your insurance and the Swiss vignette(40chf per year) and your done.


Supermarkets are generally open until 8pm over this side of the border and even 1 or 2 open for a few hours on Sunday morning.We generally use our local Migros, and use the loyalty card every time, meaning every couple of months get vouchers getting money off. Highest I have reached is 40chf off in vouchers that work in Swiss and French Migros.


Diesel for example is also a little cheaper, my local station is 1.38eur a litre at present.


For more practical info, like english speaking dentists etc, CERN has some good info that might help here, http://club-cwc-newcomers.web.cern.ch/club-cwc-newcomers/Health.html 


Mobile phones, I did try French operators Orange and Bouygues at teh beginning, the roaming and coverage was not good for where we live on the border. I now have a Swisscom naytel prepay phone. Easy to top up online, and as long as I keep it locked on Swisscom network works very well for a good distance across the border.


Getting to and from the airport, I now always use the French Secteur of Geneva airport, there always seems to be parking available, even if the car parks are much smaller, you just duck down a back corridor into baggage arrivals and voila your on the Swiss side. Car parks are the same price as Swiss side FYI. P21 is the long term name. The section is designed for flights French domestic only, but is pretty self sufficent to the main terminal. For example car hire can be a hell of a lot cheaper over at the desks on the french secteur as are taxi's to the French towns. Car hire companies such as Europcar have an entire fleet of French cars there.


Banking, I have a French account with Credit Agricole, and have a CB (Carte Bleue) with them. This card is very handy for all things in France, tolls take it etc. I have an advisor who can speak English. Also cheque books are common and cheques are still widely used in France and can be required for getting a mobile, internet a car etc. My wife then has a UBS account with dual currency for ease of use. Charges for the French account are in line with most of europe.


When we got here we simply registered with the local mayor, Mairie, and got our Certificate of Domicille. We then got in touch with the post office to get a  post box assigned to us. And contacted the refuse company for a wheely bin and had to be delivered as well.These two actions did require a french speaker.


We found our apartment here on Glocals classifieds, and have super landlords, we signed a normal French contract and have never had a problem.


Public transport from TPG Geneva has most of the commuter towns, even across the border connected. www.tpg.ch.


Well I hope this may help some people, who are thinking about the life as a Frontalier, or even already in it.


If you have any questions, fire away and I'll see what i can do to answer.


Final tip, when your settled in France, read 'A year in the Merde', can be amusing the observations that ring true.


All the best.


Kev


 

The text you are quoting:

Hey all,


Just want to post a few links and some tips, for the new or even existing frontalier. It seems spring is in the air, and as like myself this time last year, people are now on the move into and out of Geneve area.


I live just across the border in a small French village, it took a while but we now have a good friend basis of bothe French and expats alike, and are close to supermarkets etc. Shopping in France is cheaper as is rent and utilities, you may not be next to a hundred restaurants, nightclubs and need to drive most places but this is the price you pay for cheaper rent and a quieter pace of life.


If you are considering a frontalier move, there is an association dedicated to the cause. http://www.frontalier.org/index.htm


I do not work in Geneve but my wife does, and she has dual country insurance with MMA in Ferney Voltaire at around 116eur a month.


We use Orange.fr internet and phone, a package is around 36eur a month.Picked this up at the local Orange shop, took about 2 months to get it finally installed due to complications but since then no problems at all, always have 100mbs connection, and a phone line with free calls to most EU landlines. They have an english support line also.


We have 2 cars on the road with insurance costing around 100eur a month for both .A big 4x4 and a small cinqecento, no claims did not carry over for me but its still cheaper than the same insurance in Ireland for example. I use AXA France, they do not have an English speaking line, but I got nearly everything done online, and then my very few words of French and a patient customer service agent got the rest done. Big bonus about the French car, no road tax in France, so all you need to pay is your insurance and the Swiss vignette(40chf per year) and your done.


Supermarkets are generally open until 8pm over this side of the border and even 1 or 2 open for a few hours on Sunday morning.We generally use our local Migros, and use the loyalty card every time, meaning every couple of months get vouchers getting money off. Highest I have reached is 40chf off in vouchers that work in Swiss and French Migros.


Diesel for example is also a little cheaper, my local station is 1.38eur a litre at present.


For more practical info, like english speaking dentists etc, CERN has some good info that might help here, http://club-cwc-newcomers.web.cern.ch/club-cwc-newcomers/Health.html 


Mobile phones, I did try French operators Orange and Bouygues at teh beginning, the roaming and coverage was not good for where we live on the border. I now have a Swisscom naytel prepay phone. Easy to top up online, and as long as I keep it locked on Swisscom network works very well for a good distance across the border.


Getting to and from the airport, I now always use the French Secteur of Geneva airport, there always seems to be parking available, even if the car parks are much smaller, you just duck down a back corridor into baggage arrivals and voila your on the Swiss side. Car parks are the same price as Swiss side FYI. P21 is the long term name. The section is designed for flights French domestic only, but is pretty self sufficent to the main terminal. For example car hire can be a hell of a lot cheaper over at the desks on the french secteur as are taxi's to the French towns. Car hire companies such as Europcar have an entire fleet of French cars there.


Banking, I have a French account with Credit Agricole, and have a CB (Carte Bleue) with them. This card is very handy for all things in France, tolls take it etc. I have an advisor who can speak English. Also cheque books are common and cheques are still widely used in France and can be required for getting a mobile, internet a car etc. My wife then has a UBS account with dual currency for ease of use. Charges for the French account are in line with most of europe.


When we got here we simply registered with the local mayor, Mairie, and got our Certificate of Domicille. We then got in touch with the post office to get a  post box assigned to us. And contacted the refuse company for a wheely bin and had to be delivered as well.These two actions did require a french speaker.


We found our apartment here on Glocals classifieds, and have super landlords, we signed a normal French contract and have never had a problem.


Public transport from TPG Geneva has most of the commuter towns, even across the border connected. www.tpg.ch.


Well I hope this may help some people, who are thinking about the life as a Frontalier, or even already in it.


If you have any questions, fire away and I'll see what i can do to answer.


Final tip, when your settled in France, read 'A year in the Merde', can be amusing the observations that ring true.


All the best.


Kev


 


Kevin MApr 2, 2012 @ 10:13
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 1

Also - for the frontaliers - biking is a very handy alternative to the TPG service, and will be much faster if you are coming from Annemasse, Ville-la-Grand, etc... They have just gotten rid of the bike vignette in Switzerland for 2012 - note though that there is a 40 CHF fine for riding on the sidewalk, and that includes the parking lots around the Chene-Bourg area.


If you are in the Gaillard area, the Intermarche in the Z.I. Chatelaine is open 'til 12 on Sundays, and in Annemasse the Carrefour Market on ave. Florissant is open 'til noon on Sundays over the summer.


   - Thanks for the helpful info Kevin!

The text you are quoting:

Also - for the frontaliers - biking is a very handy alternative to the TPG service, and will be much faster if you are coming from Annemasse, Ville-la-Grand, etc... They have just gotten rid of the bike vignette in Switzerland for 2012 - note though that there is a 40 CHF fine for riding on the sidewalk, and that includes the parking lots around the Chene-Bourg area.


If you are in the Gaillard area, the Intermarche in the Z.I. Chatelaine is open 'til 12 on Sundays, and in Annemasse the Carrefour Market on ave. Florissant is open 'til noon on Sundays over the summer.


   - Thanks for the helpful info Kevin!


Nikarie C, Apr 2, 2012 @ 11:39
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 2

Kevin, what's the story with non-EU frontaliers and permanent residence in France?  Can they eventually qualify?

The text you are quoting:

Kevin, what's the story with non-EU frontaliers and permanent residence in France?  Can they eventually qualify?


richardm, Apr 2, 2012 @ 11:59
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Great post Kev...

The text you are quoting:

Great post Kev...


Charlie, Apr 2, 2012 @ 12:20
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 4

Kevin, what's the story with non-EU frontaliers and permanent residence in France?  Can they eventually qualify?


Apr 2, 12 11:59

Ok, not sure 100% on if it works or not to be honest. My Wife being a Slovak citizen actually waited until Slovakias full accension into the EU occured last year before going for Permit. Her companies legal department encouraged her to work as a freelancer for the first few months and pay taxes to France. So this might tell you something. The word on the street is the G permit is issued only to full EU citizens but I have found some conflicting reports so its worth checking perhaps with your embassey or the Swiss govt. Or the guys at Frontalier legal, http://www.frontalier.org/english_info2.htm


 


In Theory it should be as easy as this Undecided,


I Reckon for a non eu citizen you need to jump through the French hoops first,


http://frenchalps.angloinfo.com/countries/france/residency.asp


Get yourself registered as a resident of France. Domicille and Visa's etc.


Then worry about the Swiss permit,


My Wife has a G permit, which allows this:


http://www.justlanded.com/english/Switzerland/Switzerland-Guide/Visas-Permits/Residence-permits


and according to these guys falls also under non eu nationals,


https://www.henleyglobal.com/countries/switzerland/residence/permits/


Then for Taxes, at the end of the year your employer should provide you special tax forms, and there is one of these that is sent to Paris. This shows the French that you are paying taxes in Switzerland.


more info here, albeit a little vague on these exact circumstances.


http://www.wfb.ch/public/fact_sheets/fs_2.09/en/work_and_residence.pdf


 


Hope it helps.


 


kev

The text you are quoting:

Ok, not sure 100% on if it works or not to be honest. My Wife being a Slovak citizen actually waited until Slovakias full accension into the EU occured last year before going for Permit. Her companies legal department encouraged her to work as a freelancer for the first few months and pay taxes to France. So this might tell you something. The word on the street is the G permit is issued only to full EU citizens but I have found some conflicting reports so its worth checking perhaps with your embassey or the Swiss govt. Or the guys at Frontalier legal, http://www.frontalier.org/english_info2.htm


 


In Theory it should be as easy as this Undecided,


I Reckon for a non eu citizen you need to jump through the French hoops first,


http://frenchalps.angloinfo.com/countries/france/residency.asp


Get yourself registered as a resident of France. Domicille and Visa's etc.


Then worry about the Swiss permit,


My Wife has a G permit, which allows this:


http://www.justlanded.com/english/Switzerland/Switzerland-Guide/Visas-Permits/Residence-permits


and according to these guys falls also under non eu nationals,


https://www.henleyglobal.com/countries/switzerland/residence/permits/


Then for Taxes, at the end of the year your employer should provide you special tax forms, and there is one of these that is sent to Paris. This shows the French that you are paying taxes in Switzerland.


more info here, albeit a little vague on these exact circumstances.


http://www.wfb.ch/public/fact_sheets/fs_2.09/en/work_and_residence.pdf


 


Hope it helps.


 


kev


Kevin M, Apr 2, 2012 @ 12:15
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 5

Good information.  Living across the border sounds attractive but I'm halfway to a C-permit and don't wanna rock the boat.

The text you are quoting:

Good information.  Living across the border sounds attractive but I'm halfway to a C-permit and don't wanna rock the boat.


richardm, Apr 2, 2012 @ 13:19
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 6

Hello Kevin,


My and my friend are moving to the area to become fronteliers too, he's French and I am Spanish, I am actively looking for a role there and have plan to go there by October, what will be the best way to find a flat from London please?


There is so much scam going on that scares me.


 


Many thanks,


Miguel


 


 

The text you are quoting:

Hello Kevin,


My and my friend are moving to the area to become fronteliers too, he's French and I am Spanish, I am actively looking for a role there and have plan to go there by October, what will be the best way to find a flat from London please?


There is so much scam going on that scares me.


 


Many thanks,


Miguel


 


 


Miguel U, Aug 7, 2012 @ 01:32
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 7

For living in France there are a few things you can do.


1: Check classifieds here in Glocals, and also on World Radio Switzerland sites.


2: Set up some alerts for the area you want to live and living criteria on French real estate websites. www.paravendu.fr www.seloger.com www.century21.fr


You should know, even this side of the border, rentals don't hang around too long. We have just moved, and applied for the house on viewing. (Presented ID papers, proof of income, Domicille)


Good Luck


 


Kev


 


 

The text you are quoting:

For living in France there are a few things you can do.


1: Check classifieds here in Glocals, and also on World Radio Switzerland sites.


2: Set up some alerts for the area you want to live and living criteria on French real estate websites. www.paravendu.fr www.seloger.com www.century21.fr


You should know, even this side of the border, rentals don't hang around too long. We have just moved, and applied for the house on viewing. (Presented ID papers, proof of income, Domicille)


Good Luck


 


Kev


 


 


Kevin M, Aug 7, 2012 @ 07:49
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 8

Many thanks Kevin for the info, if anyone has a flat to let from end September please doget in touch.


Best,


Miguel


 


 


 


 


 

The text you are quoting:

Many thanks Kevin for the info, if anyone has a flat to let from end September please doget in touch.


Best,


Miguel


 


 


 


 


 


Miguel U, Aug 7, 2012 @ 13:26
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 9

Miguel, you might also consider looking a little further afield in France. We live in a village a few kilometers from Bellegarde, which has a train station (also TGV) from which you can get into Geneva in 25 minutes. Quicker than most of my colleagues commute by car, and prices in our area are much better than in the border areas such as Thoiry, Ferney and St. Genis.

The text you are quoting:

Miguel, you might also consider looking a little further afield in France. We live in a village a few kilometers from Bellegarde, which has a train station (also TGV) from which you can get into Geneva in 25 minutes. Quicker than most of my colleagues commute by car, and prices in our area are much better than in the border areas such as Thoiry, Ferney and St. Genis.


eveyansas, Aug 7, 2012 @ 16:17
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 10

Thank you very much, any specif places? If you need to move to anoher place in the area which one would you choose?


Thank you!

The text you are quoting:

Thank you very much, any specif places? If you need to move to anoher place in the area which one would you choose?


Thank you!


Miguel U, Aug 7, 2012 @ 16:35
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 11

I am very happy with our area, which is safe and pretty and has most of the amenities. Definitely make sure you have a good train connection (again, Bellegarde is good for this and there are lots of villages outside of Bellegarde that are within a 10-minute or less train ride). Our village is near another called Confort. I guess it depends a lot on what sort of place you're seeking -- we wanted rural, which of course means a bit isolated. Bellegarde has about 12,000 people, so bigger, but not like a Geneva, of course. If I had to move I might consider around Collonges, though you'd have to take a car and park it and take a tram or bus into Geneva. I find the Annecy area very nice as well but I don't know a thing about actually living there or getting into Geneva from there.

The text you are quoting:

I am very happy with our area, which is safe and pretty and has most of the amenities. Definitely make sure you have a good train connection (again, Bellegarde is good for this and there are lots of villages outside of Bellegarde that are within a 10-minute or less train ride). Our village is near another called Confort. I guess it depends a lot on what sort of place you're seeking -- we wanted rural, which of course means a bit isolated. Bellegarde has about 12,000 people, so bigger, but not like a Geneva, of course. If I had to move I might consider around Collonges, though you'd have to take a car and park it and take a tram or bus into Geneva. I find the Annecy area very nice as well but I don't know a thing about actually living there or getting into Geneva from there.


eveyansas, Aug 7, 2012 @ 16:43
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 12

Thank you , I think I wiill try Bellegarde as I am not going to have  a car for the first few months as i nver needed one in London, seems that is virtally impossible find a flat unless you are already in the country, so I wll be paying a visit to the area soon. Thanks, Miguel

The text you are quoting:

Thank you , I think I wiill try Bellegarde as I am not going to have  a car for the first few months as i nver needed one in London, seems that is virtally impossible find a flat unless you are already in the country, so I wll be paying a visit to the area soon. Thanks, Miguel


Miguel U, Aug 7, 2012 @ 16:56
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 13

One last thought: I do have a car but recently bought a scooter for easy transport to and from the train station. Great way to get around in my area and lots of fun. That doesn't work as well in the winter but great when the weather is fine. Otherwise, if you are right in Bellegarde, you don't even really need a car. Good luck to you. :)

The text you are quoting:

One last thought: I do have a car but recently bought a scooter for easy transport to and from the train station. Great way to get around in my area and lots of fun. That doesn't work as well in the winter but great when the weather is fine. Otherwise, if you are right in Bellegarde, you don't even really need a car. Good luck to you. :)


eveyansas, Aug 7, 2012 @ 17:03
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 14

Just adding a post, so this can hit the front page again. Seems to be a new wave of new folks in town looking for info!


 


Cool

The text you are quoting:

Just adding a post, so this can hit the front page again. Seems to be a new wave of new folks in town looking for info!


 


Cool


Kevin M, Oct 8, 2012 @ 13:21
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 15

Dear Richardm,


I have te same situation, have permanent residenc in france but working in geneve. Please, can you tell me how did it go on your case for tax issue..


 do you have to pay tax for both states france and swiss or there is an tax agreement between these two states for frontalier people.


 


Thank you

The text you are quoting:

Dear Richardm,


I have te same situation, have permanent residenc in france but working in geneve. Please, can you tell me how did it go on your case for tax issue..


 do you have to pay tax for both states france and swiss or there is an tax agreement between these two states for frontalier people.


 


Thank you


fred kika, Oct 7, 2013 @ 10:48
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Re: For the frontalier...
Post 16

Great post! Two questions:


• Do you know where to find good advice about transitioning a child from international school to the French system, and about French scholls around Geneva?


• Has anything changed in the eight years since you wrote this post?

The text you are quoting:

Great post! Two questions:


• Do you know where to find good advice about transitioning a child from international school to the French system, and about French scholls around Geneva?


• Has anything changed in the eight years since you wrote this post?


Leif R, Jun 15, 2020 @ 09:36
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