Howdy Avi_,



Have you considered one of those ASUS Eee PC things? They're cheap as chips and about as lightweight as a computer can feasibly be. If you have no major computational requirements (you just want to send mail, surf, write a few things down), then that could maybe suit you pretty well. I guess they have them in all the stores nowadays. Or check out one of those pricerunner type websites.
hayes, Oct 18, 2008 @ 14:19

Hi Avi,



You best bet would be to buy new since the price competition at the moment is really something.



The two best options would be to look at the ads from Interdiscount XXL that come out every couple of weeks. The other is to look at the specials from MediaMarkt. The tend to come out every two weeks as well. Both have stores in Geneva.



You can get something in the 15 inch screen size for about CHF 800 with everything you need for surfing the web. You could also look at one of the net-books (9 inch screen) but the size of the keyboard is a real pain for the typing. You can get an ASUS net-book for about CHF 600. I would recommend a regular size laptop for the small difference in price if you don't mind the size.



If you would like me to tell you the next time I see one of the specials, send me a PM.



Good luck,



Verbier
Verbier, Oct 18, 2008 @ 14:20

I did a bit of research on the netbooks with the idea of buying one. Some considerations: The 8 inch or 9 inch screen size on the netbooks is a real issue if you want to surf the web. It is best to have very good eyesight. The keyboard size means you have to do one finger typing and slowly so they are not great if you need to type any longer emails. They are however a way to access the net if you are on the go and you can't afford to carry a normal 15 inch laptop.



Avi has not specified if size/weight/travel is a major concern. This might still push him in the direction of one of the Asus netbooks. He needs to understand the compromise of going in this direction.



In any event, I would not go for one of the smaller Asus models. I would go with the new 10 inch model that just came out (comes in three versions). Here is a link to look at. At least with this model, you are getting to a screen size that makes sense and a keyboard where you do not hit two keys at the same time when you type.



http://www.microspot.ch/microspot/product/Notebooks/0000284732/Asus_EeePC_1000H_Win_white_Swiss_French/detail.jsf



Verbier
Verbier, Oct 18, 2008 @ 18:54

I've seen at Fust in Carouge and as the post office very decent laptops at CHF 799.- FNAC also has good deals all the time and I recommend that you pay them a visit. Last but not least, DELL is always a good option (I'm using one right now).



Criteria to keep in mind : Enough memory (2Gb is a minimum), a wide screen (> 15") with a reasonably good resolution (1280x800) and built-in WiFi.
Free, Oct 18, 2008 @ 20:34

Thanks everybody for the very helpful information given!

 

I see that the operating systems offered on Swiss websites are either French or German

Does anybody know if they support or can be converted to English?

 

What about the keyboards? are they different from British or American ones?

 
Avi_, Oct 19, 2008 @ 00:31

You should be able to change the operating system (XP or Vista) into English. You would then buy Office etc. in English. Not a big deal.



Here are the details on the keyboards.



Swiss keyboard layout:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:KB_Swiss.svg



US keyboard layout:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:KB_United_States-NoAltGr.svg



The only real difference from the US to the CH keyboard is the Z and Y are reversed. For the rest the CH keyboard is easier to use for anyone. Will take a week to adjust then will be fine.



If you need a US keyboard at all costs, you can order your laptop from the US. Not an issue. Just need to change the plug for the charger.
Verbier, Oct 19, 2008 @ 01:13

Question is: what is inexpensive for you?



The problem is nicely described in this quote that seems to be (falsely) attributed to John Ruskin (had to look this up in wikiquote...):



There is hardly anything in the world that someone cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price alone are that person's lawful prey.



I have to say: I would never buy a laptop from any of the "supermarket"-type stores - these are all "consumer" notebooks that only appeal to consumers but in reality are not designed for the need of the consumer.

The only exception is Apple (sold in MediaMarkt - don't know if they have that in GE/VS/VD). You should _really_ take the time and visit their new store in Geneva (or Zurich) to see the new aluminum-unibody models first-hand.

They are not cheap, though, but you get what you pay for...



If you can't be convinced to buy an Apple-laptop (for whatever reason), I have to ask:



- what do you want to do with the laptop? Are you using it as a kind of "un-ugly" desktop replacement or is actual runtime on battery an issue? I doubt that most models on display in Interdiscount can break the 3h barrier - some will barely scratch the 2h mark...

(Apples MacBook: normal use: 5-6 hours, over 3hours DVD-playback...)

- can you live with your laptop being "in repair" for days/weeks/months, possibly coming back more broken than sent-in?

- can you live with a tiny screen and a fumbly keyboard? (Netbooks, Ultra-Subnotebooks)

- how much do you want to spend, actually?



If Apple is not an option, go to www.dell.ch, say that you are a business-customer and select one of their cheap business-notebooks (they also sell to non-businesses - with their current quarterly numbers, they need _every_ sale...).

They are usually also not loaded with crapware that makes the system crawl on bootup.

Or get a business-laptop from HP/Lenovo or Fujitsu-Siemens, and in any case, get the three-year warranty extension (also valid for Apple-notebooks...).

Also get the Vista-to-XP downgrade option (available with most business-notebooks).

Who in his right mind runs Vista on a system with less than 2 GB of RAM?

Maybe you can "tune" it to run better on weaker system - but if you like to tweak and tune (instead of "just use" your system, better install Linux ;-)))



People think, "oh, it's only 500 CHF" (or whatever), "if it breaks after a while, I'll just throw it away and buy a new one".

That "after a while" may be sooner than you think (usually after the warranty runs out) - and then you may not have the money to actually buy a new one.



Sorry if that sounds like a rant (it is, more or less) - but I see too many people who basically think that what applies to butter ("cheapest is still good enough for me") also applies to laptops/desktops.

The "problem" is that Apple is on its best way to quasi-monopolize the high-end (>1200) and super-highend (>2500 CHF) laptop-market.

That basically leaves only the proverbial scraps for the other vendors at the low-end - a market segment where prices are declining and competition is rising (as more and more vendors are trying to get a foot in it).

In theory, this is good for the consumer - but at the margins yielded in a sub-600 CHF notebook, QA, support, (repair-)service is simply not possible.

At least not in the way people might expect it...





So, think before you spend ;-)





Rainer
rainer_d, Oct 20, 2008 @ 03:30

One other option in the netbook category (10 inch screen) is available from Aldi. This model has quite good reviews. The other netbook option is of course the new ASUS 10 inch model.



The Aldi model is available as of the 27th. They tend to sell out very quickly.



ALDI netbook



This one comes with Windows XP home rather than Vista which is a good idea.
Verbier, Oct 20, 2008 @ 22:55

I know Vista has had a bad press but I've been using it for 6 months on a Dell laptop and am very pleased.  Yes, you need 2G of RAM, but that is not expensive.  Starting up and shutting down is so much quicker than my XP desktop (admittedly it is a bit cluttered!).  I've also been using a small ASUS running XP recently - definitely slower but fine for web work and even my thick fingers manage to type OK on it.  Certainly worth looking at.
RogerF, Oct 20, 2008 @ 23:09

Hi avi, we met at the entrepneurs thing at the end of august. for carrying under ur arm and for quick and easy use, i would recommend the advent subnotebook. its screen is about 9 or ten inches. if u need an all day computer this isnt for u. but its a verz good machine. get it with xp. dont bother with vista or linux, they are a total waste of time in this part of the market space. make sure it has 2 gig ram memory minimum. there are two or three subnotes around this siye. i know u travel to the uk a bit so go to pc world and u can pick one up there. fnac or fust at balaxert hav something imilar. i read reviews of it and thez were good. it should cost around 280 sterling plus a bit more for the upgrade from 1 gig ram (standard) to 2 gig. the advent comes with 80gig hard drive. u could always buy an external hard drive. it doesnt come with dvd drive but it weighs less than 1 kg and u can carry it easily under ur arm. i am going to buy one myself shortly. the key thing is this; small screen of 9 or ten inches halves the weight but not necessarily the performance or battery life.  if u email me at william@paramount comms.com i will try to find u the model number. shalom

william_chf, Oct 20, 2008 @ 23:49