This post was REVISED on Sat Sep 23, based on memebrs' early feedback to the original post. The original post was focused on preventing spammers only. This revised post expands the discussion into an overall quality community.
------------------------
Here's how we plan to ensure GoL remains a quality community. We'd love to hear more thoghts/ideas.
THE PROBLEM
1. Currently, any person who has an Email account can join GoL. We can track the users' IP addresses, but with today's internet cafes the IP address is - many times - meaningless.
2. This creates several probs:
- professional spammers join GoL and bombard members with hoax messages (aimed at getting money out of innocent members). We block these spammers, but they re-register 2 minutes later using a different Email account. This happens about 2 times a month, and can easily grow further.
- 'regular' members have less an incentive to respect the community guidelines (ie - to insult other members, to initiate sex chats, etc), knowing that even if they get flagged and kicked out, they can re-join using a different Email / pseudo. This happens about 10 times a month.
THE IDEAL SITUATION (WE THINK...)
1. That folks who join GoL respect each other and the community guidelines.
2. That if folks clearly and severly abuse the community (how we judge this is a seperate big discussion), we have a way of removing them from GoL with low risk of them coming back via the back door.
THE POTENTIAL FUTURE SOLUTION
This idea went back and forth on the forums, with some great members' feedback. Here's what we're thinking of:
New members will be able to join GoL only in these 2 ways:
1. If they were invited to join by existing and trusted GoL members.
OR:
2. If they are willing to activate their new GoL account via SMS (thus making themselves more trace-able).
The above idea will NOT not solve ALL the issues, but it will go a long way towards making it harder for spammers to join, and making it harder for people who were banneed (for the right reasons) to return.
If we do go this route, we'll ensure new members that their mobile numbers are kept 100% confidentials. We'll also have to take the risk of some people not having mobiles, but this is very marginal.
What think?
Global Forums > News from the Site Admin > Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
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Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:25
The text you are quoting:
This post was REVISED on Sat Sep 23, based on memebrs' early feedback to the original post. The original post was focused on preventing spammers only. This revised post expands the discussion into an overall quality community.
------------------------
Here's how we plan to ensure GoL remains a quality community. We'd love to hear more thoghts/ideas.
THE PROBLEM
1. Currently, any person who has an Email account can join GoL. We can track the users' IP addresses, but with today's internet cafes the IP address is - many times - meaningless.
2. This creates several probs:
- professional spammers join GoL and bombard members with hoax messages (aimed at getting money out of innocent members). We block these spammers, but they re-register 2 minutes later using a different Email account. This happens about 2 times a month, and can easily grow further.
- 'regular' members have less an incentive to respect the community guidelines (ie - to insult other members, to initiate sex chats, etc), knowing that even if they get flagged and kicked out, they can re-join using a different Email / pseudo. This happens about 10 times a month.
THE IDEAL SITUATION (WE THINK...)
1. That folks who join GoL respect each other and the community guidelines.
2. That if folks clearly and severly abuse the community (how we judge this is a seperate big discussion), we have a way of removing them from GoL with low risk of them coming back via the back door.
THE POTENTIAL FUTURE SOLUTION
This idea went back and forth on the forums, with some great members' feedback. Here's what we're thinking of:
New members will be able to join GoL only in these 2 ways:
1. If they were invited to join by existing and trusted GoL members.
OR:
2. If they are willing to activate their new GoL account via SMS (thus making themselves more trace-able).
The above idea will NOT not solve ALL the issues, but it will go a long way towards making it harder for spammers to join, and making it harder for people who were banneed (for the right reasons) to return.
If we do go this route, we'll ensure new members that their mobile numbers are kept 100% confidentials. We'll also have to take the risk of some people not having mobiles, but this is very marginal.
What think?
Nir OfekSep 22, 2006 @ 20:25
------------------------
Here's how we plan to ensure GoL remains a quality community. We'd love to hear more thoghts/ideas.
THE PROBLEM
1. Currently, any person who has an Email account can join GoL. We can track the users' IP addresses, but with today's internet cafes the IP address is - many times - meaningless.
2. This creates several probs:
- professional spammers join GoL and bombard members with hoax messages (aimed at getting money out of innocent members). We block these spammers, but they re-register 2 minutes later using a different Email account. This happens about 2 times a month, and can easily grow further.
- 'regular' members have less an incentive to respect the community guidelines (ie - to insult other members, to initiate sex chats, etc), knowing that even if they get flagged and kicked out, they can re-join using a different Email / pseudo. This happens about 10 times a month.
THE IDEAL SITUATION (WE THINK...)
1. That folks who join GoL respect each other and the community guidelines.
2. That if folks clearly and severly abuse the community (how we judge this is a seperate big discussion), we have a way of removing them from GoL with low risk of them coming back via the back door.
THE POTENTIAL FUTURE SOLUTION
This idea went back and forth on the forums, with some great members' feedback. Here's what we're thinking of:
New members will be able to join GoL only in these 2 ways:
1. If they were invited to join by existing and trusted GoL members.
OR:
2. If they are willing to activate their new GoL account via SMS (thus making themselves more trace-able).
The above idea will NOT not solve ALL the issues, but it will go a long way towards making it harder for spammers to join, and making it harder for people who were banneed (for the right reasons) to return.
If we do go this route, we'll ensure new members that their mobile numbers are kept 100% confidentials. We'll also have to take the risk of some people not having mobiles, but this is very marginal.
What think?
Nir OfekSep 22, 2006 @ 20:25
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 1
Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:44
As discussed in the other thread, it looks good.
But wouldn't it be a problem for someone just arriving there, and not having friend and a swiss phone yet?
I also saw sometimes on the forum posts from people not in geneva yet asking about informations, introducing them (Hi, I'll be there in 3 monthes, look forward to see you, etc) or other things like that. They probably arrive it by google or something like that (you should know it much better than us), and it means they couldn't do it with that change. Is it annoying or not I don't know, it's up to you to choose if you "want" them as members.
Remy
But wouldn't it be a problem for someone just arriving there, and not having friend and a swiss phone yet?
I also saw sometimes on the forum posts from people not in geneva yet asking about informations, introducing them (Hi, I'll be there in 3 monthes, look forward to see you, etc) or other things like that. They probably arrive it by google or something like that (you should know it much better than us), and it means they couldn't do it with that change. Is it annoying or not I don't know, it's up to you to choose if you "want" them as members.
Remy
The text you are quoting:
As discussed in the other thread, it looks good.
But wouldn't it be a problem for someone just arriving there, and not having friend and a swiss phone yet?
I also saw sometimes on the forum posts from people not in geneva yet asking about informations, introducing them (Hi, I'll be there in 3 monthes, look forward to see you, etc) or other things like that. They probably arrive it by google or something like that (you should know it much better than us), and it means they couldn't do it with that change. Is it annoying or not I don't know, it's up to you to choose if you "want" them as members.
Remy
RemyS, Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:44
But wouldn't it be a problem for someone just arriving there, and not having friend and a swiss phone yet?
I also saw sometimes on the forum posts from people not in geneva yet asking about informations, introducing them (Hi, I'll be there in 3 monthes, look forward to see you, etc) or other things like that. They probably arrive it by google or something like that (you should know it much better than us), and it means they couldn't do it with that change. Is it annoying or not I don't know, it's up to you to choose if you "want" them as members.
Remy
RemyS, Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:44
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 2
Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:50
I don't think the invite option is a good idea, reason being that alot of people on here were looking information regarding Geneva and found this site and then want to post a question regarding Geneva. A lot of these people are new to Geneva. How are they going to ask a question or met people if they don't know any members to start with, if they need to be invited.
The mobile option is more viable, but some poeple don't have mobiles and how you going to manage the cost of international mobiles. Start charging a joining fee!
Wouldn't member activation by Email be more viable. Thus confirming there Email address.
The mobile option is more viable, but some poeple don't have mobiles and how you going to manage the cost of international mobiles. Start charging a joining fee!
Wouldn't member activation by Email be more viable. Thus confirming there Email address.
The text you are quoting:
I don't think the invite option is a good idea, reason being that alot of people on here were looking information regarding Geneva and found this site and then want to post a question regarding Geneva. A lot of these people are new to Geneva. How are they going to ask a question or met people if they don't know any members to start with, if they need to be invited.
The mobile option is more viable, but some poeple don't have mobiles and how you going to manage the cost of international mobiles. Start charging a joining fee!
Wouldn't member activation by Email be more viable. Thus confirming there Email address.
Mark, Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:50
The mobile option is more viable, but some poeple don't have mobiles and how you going to manage the cost of international mobiles. Start charging a joining fee!
Wouldn't member activation by Email be more viable. Thus confirming there Email address.
Mark, Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:50
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 3
Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:57
Why couldn't a spammer verify an e-mail adress?
Remy
Remy
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 4
Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:59
No one said they coudln't. I believe they are wanting to put some spammers off by having the ability to trace them.
The text you are quoting:
No one said they coudln't. I believe they are wanting to put some spammers off by having the ability to trace them.
Mark, Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:59
Mark, Sep 22, 2006 @ 20:59
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 5
Sep 23, 2006 @ 03:27
So it sounds like twice a month someone sends out a slew of pretty-obvious-bogus messages that are of annoyance. By the time the account is flagged any communication has already been marked as spam so anyone who trys to communicate again with this person will realise that they are a spammer.
I applaud efforts to reduce this but at what cost to new commers to the community? Also, aside from an admittedly infrequent annoyance, is there much risk to users? If someone you don't know suddenly starts asking for money or your phone number I think everyone on this site is mature enough to understand that something is fishy. We're not talking MySpace here so the need to protect users is lessened.
I guess my position is pretty clear but the risk of appearing as a clique or closed community to newcomers is a real concern, and the hassle of a couple bogus messages a month is month is pretty small. I spend more time going through my email Spam inbox to fetch real emails than I do deleting obvious spam on GoL.
Cheers,
Matt
I applaud efforts to reduce this but at what cost to new commers to the community? Also, aside from an admittedly infrequent annoyance, is there much risk to users? If someone you don't know suddenly starts asking for money or your phone number I think everyone on this site is mature enough to understand that something is fishy. We're not talking MySpace here so the need to protect users is lessened.
I guess my position is pretty clear but the risk of appearing as a clique or closed community to newcomers is a real concern, and the hassle of a couple bogus messages a month is month is pretty small. I spend more time going through my email Spam inbox to fetch real emails than I do deleting obvious spam on GoL.
Cheers,
Matt
The text you are quoting:
So it sounds like twice a month someone sends out a slew of pretty-obvious-bogus messages that are of annoyance. By the time the account is flagged any communication has already been marked as spam so anyone who trys to communicate again with this person will realise that they are a spammer.
I applaud efforts to reduce this but at what cost to new commers to the community? Also, aside from an admittedly infrequent annoyance, is there much risk to users? If someone you don't know suddenly starts asking for money or your phone number I think everyone on this site is mature enough to understand that something is fishy. We're not talking MySpace here so the need to protect users is lessened.
I guess my position is pretty clear but the risk of appearing as a clique or closed community to newcomers is a real concern, and the hassle of a couple bogus messages a month is month is pretty small. I spend more time going through my email Spam inbox to fetch real emails than I do deleting obvious spam on GoL.
Cheers,
Matt
mrbeau, Sep 23, 2006 @ 03:27
I applaud efforts to reduce this but at what cost to new commers to the community? Also, aside from an admittedly infrequent annoyance, is there much risk to users? If someone you don't know suddenly starts asking for money or your phone number I think everyone on this site is mature enough to understand that something is fishy. We're not talking MySpace here so the need to protect users is lessened.
I guess my position is pretty clear but the risk of appearing as a clique or closed community to newcomers is a real concern, and the hassle of a couple bogus messages a month is month is pretty small. I spend more time going through my email Spam inbox to fetch real emails than I do deleting obvious spam on GoL.
Cheers,
Matt
mrbeau, Sep 23, 2006 @ 03:27
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 6
Sep 23, 2006 @ 10:17
Is it possible that you can nab the IP address when they signup? Much easier to stop them at the source that way...
The text you are quoting:
Is it possible that you can nab the IP address when they signup? Much easier to stop them at the source that way...
Rasta, Sep 23, 2006 @ 10:17
Rasta, Sep 23, 2006 @ 10:17
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 7
Sep 23, 2006 @ 14:21
won't work for those that use cyber cafes.
The text you are quoting:
won't work for those that use cyber cafes.
mrbeau, Sep 23, 2006 @ 14:21
mrbeau, Sep 23, 2006 @ 14:21
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 8
Sep 23, 2006 @ 17:20
the user has been personally invited by existing GoL members
OR:
they activate their new GoL by their mobile phone
New members generally posts their queries in the Forum. So, there is little need to Send mail to people they don't know.
Without member verification their mailbox is enabled to only RECEIVE mail and REPLY to Sender only. SEND function is blocked.
This may stop spammers from sending unsolicited mails.
N.
OR:
they activate their new GoL by their mobile phone
New members generally posts their queries in the Forum. So, there is little need to Send mail to people they don't know.
Without member verification their mailbox is enabled to only RECEIVE mail and REPLY to Sender only. SEND function is blocked.
This may stop spammers from sending unsolicited mails.
N.
The text you are quoting:
the user has been personally invited by existing GoL members
OR:
they activate their new GoL by their mobile phone
New members generally posts their queries in the Forum. So, there is little need to Send mail to people they don't know.
Without member verification their mailbox is enabled to only RECEIVE mail and REPLY to Sender only. SEND function is blocked.
This may stop spammers from sending unsolicited mails.
N.
Novecento, Sep 23, 2006 @ 17:20
OR:
they activate their new GoL by their mobile phone
New members generally posts their queries in the Forum. So, there is little need to Send mail to people they don't know.
Without member verification their mailbox is enabled to only RECEIVE mail and REPLY to Sender only. SEND function is blocked.
This may stop spammers from sending unsolicited mails.
N.
Novecento, Sep 23, 2006 @ 17:20
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 9
Sep 25, 2006 @ 10:00
I think that activating the account by SMS is a great idea...
Additionally invitations to new members by those who are 'trusted' members - those who've posted say 5 msgs or who have organised events or indeed participated - these are the types of people we want, making it an active community and not just a place where so many people have an account because they thought that filling one out was a fun thing to do while bored one rainy Sunday afternoon... :-)
Additionally invitations to new members by those who are 'trusted' members - those who've posted say 5 msgs or who have organised events or indeed participated - these are the types of people we want, making it an active community and not just a place where so many people have an account because they thought that filling one out was a fun thing to do while bored one rainy Sunday afternoon... :-)
The text you are quoting:
I think that activating the account by SMS is a great idea...
Additionally invitations to new members by those who are 'trusted' members - those who've posted say 5 msgs or who have organised events or indeed participated - these are the types of people we want, making it an active community and not just a place where so many people have an account because they thought that filling one out was a fun thing to do while bored one rainy Sunday afternoon... :-)
JulianT, Sep 25, 2006 @ 10:00
Additionally invitations to new members by those who are 'trusted' members - those who've posted say 5 msgs or who have organised events or indeed participated - these are the types of people we want, making it an active community and not just a place where so many people have an account because they thought that filling one out was a fun thing to do while bored one rainy Sunday afternoon... :-)
JulianT, Sep 25, 2006 @ 10:00
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 10
Sep 25, 2006 @ 13:56
Sounds good !
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 11
Sep 25, 2006 @ 13:59
I guess thatm at some stage, we might have to choose between two possible communities:
- open, anonymous, fast growing, with higer risk of spamming and jerks
- closed, certified, slow growing, with lower risk of spamming (but never 0%)
- open, anonymous, fast growing, with higer risk of spamming and jerks
- closed, certified, slow growing, with lower risk of spamming (but never 0%)
The text you are quoting:
I guess thatm at some stage, we might have to choose between two possible communities:
- open, anonymous, fast growing, with higer risk of spamming and jerks
- closed, certified, slow growing, with lower risk of spamming (but never 0%)
Hobbes, Sep 25, 2006 @ 13:59
- open, anonymous, fast growing, with higer risk of spamming and jerks
- closed, certified, slow growing, with lower risk of spamming (but never 0%)
Hobbes, Sep 25, 2006 @ 13:59
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Re: Quality Communty / Stopping Spammers
Post 12
Sep 29, 2006 @ 11:48
- SMS - I don't think it will work. Many ppl don't have a mobile phone when they arrive in Geneva or before arriving, and we will loose potentially interested ppl.
- Same goes with invites only.
- Since it seems that there isn't something like a unique ID code for ppl that comes from different countries, why not just making the registration process more 'complex" ??
Meaning, instead of putting only name and nickname, address, phone, email, and a valid ID references needed for the registration. (that's what they do in many italian sites, and I am sure that having to put their driving licences/ID/Passport number whatever ... will block some spammers).
Of course this means that GOL should invest more in security and storage of this data to prevent any leak and misuse. .. but that might be a solution ....
I also like the idea of not allowing ppl to send email right after they create their profile ... but I am not sure how many spammers this will prevent.
As for having a quality community I think that some sort of internal regualtion is the way to go. Nothing that wil 'rank' members in good or bad ... or active or not, in the end i still beleive that if someone wants to be in GOL and never posts, but shows up at events and parties is still as a valuable member as the usual 'forum spammers :p ' ... as long as his attitude at the event is friendly! I'd rather say some sort of reporting system for ppl with non friendly behaviour ....
this is it and all for today.
Vale
- Same goes with invites only.
- Since it seems that there isn't something like a unique ID code for ppl that comes from different countries, why not just making the registration process more 'complex" ??
Meaning, instead of putting only name and nickname, address, phone, email, and a valid ID references needed for the registration. (that's what they do in many italian sites, and I am sure that having to put their driving licences/ID/Passport number whatever ... will block some spammers).
Of course this means that GOL should invest more in security and storage of this data to prevent any leak and misuse. .. but that might be a solution ....
I also like the idea of not allowing ppl to send email right after they create their profile ... but I am not sure how many spammers this will prevent.
As for having a quality community I think that some sort of internal regualtion is the way to go. Nothing that wil 'rank' members in good or bad ... or active or not, in the end i still beleive that if someone wants to be in GOL and never posts, but shows up at events and parties is still as a valuable member as the usual 'forum spammers :p ' ... as long as his attitude at the event is friendly! I'd rather say some sort of reporting system for ppl with non friendly behaviour ....
this is it and all for today.
Vale
The text you are quoting:
- SMS - I don't think it will work. Many ppl don't have a mobile phone when they arrive in Geneva or before arriving, and we will loose potentially interested ppl.
- Same goes with invites only.
- Since it seems that there isn't something like a unique ID code for ppl that comes from different countries, why not just making the registration process more 'complex" ??
Meaning, instead of putting only name and nickname, address, phone, email, and a valid ID references needed for the registration. (that's what they do in many italian sites, and I am sure that having to put their driving licences/ID/Passport number whatever ... will block some spammers).
Of course this means that GOL should invest more in security and storage of this data to prevent any leak and misuse. .. but that might be a solution ....
I also like the idea of not allowing ppl to send email right after they create their profile ... but I am not sure how many spammers this will prevent.
As for having a quality community I think that some sort of internal regualtion is the way to go. Nothing that wil 'rank' members in good or bad ... or active or not, in the end i still beleive that if someone wants to be in GOL and never posts, but shows up at events and parties is still as a valuable member as the usual 'forum spammers :p ' ... as long as his attitude at the event is friendly! I'd rather say some sort of reporting system for ppl with non friendly behaviour ....
this is it and all for today.
Vale
Hoiling, Sep 29, 2006 @ 11:48
- Same goes with invites only.
- Since it seems that there isn't something like a unique ID code for ppl that comes from different countries, why not just making the registration process more 'complex" ??
Meaning, instead of putting only name and nickname, address, phone, email, and a valid ID references needed for the registration. (that's what they do in many italian sites, and I am sure that having to put their driving licences/ID/Passport number whatever ... will block some spammers).
Of course this means that GOL should invest more in security and storage of this data to prevent any leak and misuse. .. but that might be a solution ....
I also like the idea of not allowing ppl to send email right after they create their profile ... but I am not sure how many spammers this will prevent.
As for having a quality community I think that some sort of internal regualtion is the way to go. Nothing that wil 'rank' members in good or bad ... or active or not, in the end i still beleive that if someone wants to be in GOL and never posts, but shows up at events and parties is still as a valuable member as the usual 'forum spammers :p ' ... as long as his attitude at the event is friendly! I'd rather say some sort of reporting system for ppl with non friendly behaviour ....
this is it and all for today.
Vale
Hoiling, Sep 29, 2006 @ 11:48
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